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Greg Siskind on Immigration Law and Policy

$1.7 TRILLION...

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...and a loss of 8.1 million jobs for US workers.



That's how much consumer spending would decline and the number jobs that would be lost if the antis got their way and all illegally present immigrants suddenly were gone, according to a study by the Perryman Group, a Texas-based economic and financial analysis firm.

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Comments

  1. indianGuy's Avatar
    They got their numbers wrong. If the illegals left the loss of GDP would be 1.7 quintillion dollars and the number of job losses would be 8.1 centillion. We will be reduced to Burkina Paso. Los Angeles will turn into Addis Ababa.
  2. lfwf's Avatar

    If you have a counter argument, make it. Otherwise, please desist from wasting everyone's time. We already know your views.
  3. The Avenger's Avatar
    I have a better idea. Why don't you desist from reading this blog and save your precious time you big dummy?
  4. Greg Siskind's Avatar
    Let's try and be civil, folks. If you disagree with what someone posts, discuss why. Leave the personal attacks out.
  5. George Chell's Avatar
    I will be very civil. As an economist I will give you my analysis. Unfortunately, pro-immigration economists have abdicated their responsibility and the anti-immigration economists such as Borjas and Briggs have moved into fill the vacuum with their voodoo. I believe that you all have heard of the term stagflation 1970s style. If we accept Borjas's prescription what we will get is the 1970s stagflation. The Fed has said that the wage-price spiral has not occurred for one main reason..there is no demand for higher wages over productivity due to labor surplus. Hence inflation has not increased like in the 1970s. The difference this time, immigration. In the 1970s we had 300,000 legal immigrants coming in, Now we have close to 800,000. Plus of course there are the illegals. If the illegals are sent home without a guest worker program, wage-price spiral will accelerate, fed will raise the interest rate over 10% as it did in the 1980s and we will have a deeper recession and a stumbling stock market with unemployment reaching 9%. This is Mark Kirkorian's vision for America. If that is what commie Goldwater wants for America, all power to him and the people of Arizona. As far as I am concerned, if a law comes in front of economic growth and lower unemployment, to hell with the law, federal, state or otherwise and here in Virginia I will continue to fight commie clones of Goldwater, Russell Pearce and Pat Buchanan. These commies are not going to subsidize me when the price accelerates and interest rates skyrocket. Neither is the racist Mark Kirkorian.
  6. BeeDee's Avatar
    I suspect there's two separate cases to consider due to the absence of significant import barriers today.

    In the first case for goods and services that can be imported, the US will import more and exporting countries like Mexico and China should benefit. In the second case for goods and services that cannot be acquired from abroad we should see a situation similar to the healthcare industry where robust immigration barriers have contributed to inflation accompanied by higher wages for workers in the healthcare industry.

    Thus the extent of the wage price inflation induced will depend on the fraction of the economy that consists of goods and services that cannot be acquired abroad. So how big is this fraction of the economy?

    And it is not logical to call anti-communists like Buchanan a commie. Buchanan believes more in white nationalism as a continuum across the centuries from Europe to present day America. If there are any commies opposed to immigration they are to be found in the Democratic party because of that party's union supporters who feel that limiting immigration is a good way of increasing wages for their members.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Buchanan
  7. George Chell's Avatar
    "And it is not logical to call anti-communists like Buchanan a commie."

    Anti-communism is in the eye of the beholder. If it walks like a commie, acts like a commie and talks like a commie, it is a commie, white nationalists or not. Soviets were commies and they claimed to support anti-colonial groups, and anti-apartheid groups, but when top ANC members went into exile, how many Soviet politburo members suggested that they give ANC members asylum? None. They did give British commies and US commie sympathizers asylum though..the common thread they were white. So Buchanan can claim to be anti-communist but all his suggestions and the policies he backs smacks of communism. He is a white nationalist. So were lots of Soviets.
  8. George Chell's Avatar
    "goods and services that cannot be acquired from abroad we should see a situation similar to the healthcare industry."

    This can be obtained abroad. I just did in Singapore for one fourth of what one has to pay for in the US.
  9. Legal and no longer waiting's Avatar
    Real conversation in women's bathromm I head a week ago: "...or you can go with us to Mexico and have a tummy tuck". 8-()
  10. BeeDee's Avatar
    "This can be obtained abroad. I just did in Singapore for one fourth of what one has to pay for in the US."

    I'm sure going forward healthcare, legal and education can increasingly be obtained abroad. But I was using healthcare as an example of a protected field to project the impact of immigration restriction on services and goods that cannot be obtained abroad.

  11. George Chell's Avatar
    "I'm sure going forward healthcare, legal and education can increasingly be obtained abroad. But I was using healthcare as an example of a protected field to project the impact of immigration restriction on services and goods that cannot be obtained abroad."

    Not legal except for some legal services. But, I refuse to do my medical checkup in the US. One doctor I went to back in 2003 made me wait for good two hours and I had fasted for over 12 hours before I came in. The nurse who took my blood insisted that I continue to wait instead of getting a cup of coffee. The moron doctor comes in and takes my pulse and says that it is at 95..and that I need to do a thyroid test. I asked him what if there was nothing. He said they need to open my heart. I said goodbye and did the entire medical check up in Singapore. They can keep protecting their services and drive the health care costs up. Eventually the insurance wont pay. I will stick with my Singapore doctor.

  12. George is funny :-)'s Avatar
    Dear George,

    You have found the perfect solution. I find my plumber inadequate and the handyman is a bit casual. I guess its time to avoid all those services in America too then. Yes, if course, the airline forgot to arrange a wheelchair for a family members after specifically being requested- could I please fly Singapore Airlines from Chicago to NYC?? Please pretty please? !!!!

    Or maybe! By the reverse logic, since my plumber is an immigrant, I should insist on never using another immigrant!!

    It's easy to take a militant stand on everything. But be nice enough not to malign whole professions or groups. Remember that despite all the hand wringing - a large chunk of new doctors in the US are either Foreign graduates or their children. Kids of Indian origin make up 10-20% of entering medical school classes for the last several years. In fact one of the chief complaints of the Indian diaspora is that their kids are being limited from admission to med schools in the name of "diversity"!
    And everytime I go to a physician- guess what? I get a foreign nurse!!! Immigration works. The system may be flawed, but the health care costs have nothing currently to do with a lack of immigration. You, the economist should have figured that out by now. But you seem to start with a predetermined answer and fit the facts to it. Just like your little tirade about "racism". For a while there, every single issue had to do with skin color - and with Kirkorian's failure to condemn foreign actors :-)

    Grow up!
  13. George Chell's Avatar
    George is funny!

    I stand by everything I have said..and I did not talk about plumbers or welders. Dont care what you think..Kirkorian is a racist.
  14. George Chell's Avatar
    And by the way, medical services are better in Singapore than in the good old USA! Spends 18% of GDP on health care and nothing much to show for!
  15. George Chell's Avatar
    Since you started the crap on racism on this post, here is some more info. I am pretty certain that AMA's bigotry limited the number of foreign doctors in the 1960s and 1970s and contributed to the sky rocketing medical costs along with advances in technology....

    http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_AMA_Issues_Apology_for_Decades_of_Racism_20305.html

    However, AMA has changed. And as for Kirkorian, read his book and show me any chapter or even a paragraph where he suggests we need to restrict immigration in sectors or professions where white immigrants predominated...acting, modeling, singing? American idol producers and hosts? No. He only wants to restrict scientists, engineers, doctors and others where non-whites predominate. Other than economic reasons, there are five reasons why we need more skilled immigrants not less: American born executives or banking industry, American born executives of the airline industry, the collapse of the levies in New Orleans, NASA's Columbia disaster and of course the collapse of the Minnesota Bridge. A week ago saturday, the CBS Forty Eight hours produced a story on a nursing home owning couple in NO who were charged with 35 counts of murder. The defense attorney got them acquited by bringing in the Army Corp of Engineers..their rep claimed that it was due to the corp's fault, but this was the best group of engineers they could recruit. If this is the best we have Kirkorian by saying we dont need more skilled immigrants is basically condoning other Katrina disasters...but then what does he care? He does not live in places like New Orleans and he certainly can afford medical care even if the price doubles.
  16. George is still funny :-)'s Avatar

    You really don't read, listen or think about other people's views do you? I never commented on whether or not Kirorian is a racist. Yet your entire new tirade is focused on this. Maybe he is. In fact I will grant you the victory :-).

    Kirkorian is racist. Happy?

    The question is, can you raise that one single fact in every single discussion, irrespective of what the issues are? Does it help to just rave and rant all the time- just read your new post and think a while. What credibility does one give to a spoilt kid that throws tantrums? I suspect people tend to ignore petulant 2 year olds.

    So the levies collapse and the banking crisis and the MN bridge and Columbia - happened all because Americans were involved? You are American are'nt you? I guess the next generation of immigrants will blame their head colds on you then. They may not make the fine little distinction you make so self indulgently - "American born". Either way your children are doomed to be at fault.

    The American medical system which I happen to know fairly well) is at the same time high quality and a complete mess. the reasons are complex. Immigration is barely involved. the natures of societies, their demands and their willingness to pony up to support the demands, often determines the services that they end up with. You reap what you sow, or actually every fool gets the incompetence he/she deserves.
    Reform will come to the health care system. As it will at long last to immigration. But true health care reform better be about much more than letting more health care workers in. And true immigration reform better be more than just pandering to each political interest. Else we are doomed.

    When I read your comments on issues that I actually understand well, it makes me doubt your authority on issues of the economy that you claim expertise in. Time to reflect Georgie boy- go buy yourself some new toys from Orchard Street and chill out.

    And of course, GROW UP :-)
  17. George Chell's Avatar
    "You really don't read, listen or think about other people's views do you? I never commented on whether or not Kirorian is a racist. Yet your entire new tirade is focused on this. Maybe he is. In fact I will grant you the victory :-).

    Kirkorian is racist. Happy?"

    Thank You!

    "The question is, can you raise that one single fact in every single discussion, irrespective of what the issues are? Does it help to just rave and rant all the time- just read your new post and think a while. What credibility does one give to a spoilt kid that throws tantrums? I suspect people tend to ignore petulant 2 year olds."

    It has helped because some moron like Romney was not nominated.

    "So the levies collapse and the banking crisis and the MN bridge and Columbia - happened all because Americans were involved? You are American are'nt you?"

    And so are all the people who died as a result also Americans. My sympathies lie with them than the incompetent Americans who caused their death. And I am interested in providing American consumers better service so that those who died in NO did not die in vain.

    "I guess the next generation of immigrants will blame their head colds on you then. They may not make the fine little distinction you make so self indulgently - "American born". Either way your children are doomed to be at fault."

    If they make the same blunder as the American clowns who ran the housing, banking, real estate and airline industry to the ground, I wont blame them if they blame us.

    :The American medical system which I happen to know fairly well) is at the same time high quality and a complete mess. the reasons are complex. Immigration is barely involved."

    Trying cutting off the supply of nurse and doctors from abroad to rural and underserved areas..let us see what happens to the doctor and nurses salaries and to health insurance.

    "the natures of societies, their demands and their willingness to pony up to support the demands, often determines the services that they end up with."

    Yes, that is why we have Americans asking for a tax cut as well as services. Anti-tax referendums these days are oepn ended and hence they pass. Let us have a referendum with tax cuts as well as specific budget cuts to pay for it..very few Americans will vote themselves a tax cut then. The mess today is because the American public wants all the services, does not want to pay for it, and borrows from other countries. Americans love to talk about defending sovereignty. A nation nose deep in debt has no sovereignty. It is a pipe dream!

    "You reap what you sow, or actually every fool gets the incompetence he/she deserves."

    Exactly right! That is why South Africa today is a mess and Singapore is booming...all the consequences of decisions made by the two countries in the 1960s.

    "Reform will come to the health care system. As it will at long last to immigration. But true health care reform better be about much more than letting more health care workers in. And true immigration reform better be more than just pandering to each political interest. Else we are doomed."

    Agreed!

    "When I read your comments on issues that I actually understand well, it makes me doubt your authority on issues of the economy that you claim expertise in."

    Then you are not an authority!

    "Time to reflect Georgie boy- go buy yourself some new toys from Orchard Street and chill out."

    Little India and Raffles City ar better...of course all of them better than downtown DC at night! or for that matter downtown Miami or LA!

    "And of course, GROW UP :-)"

    You do the same!

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