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Greg Siskind on Immigration Law and Policy

LEST YOU THINK THAT THINGS HAVE CHANGED

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As a Southerner who has been proud of the progressive changes seen in my region over the last several decades, seeing an article of this sort really makes me wonder how far you need to scratch below the surface to find the Old South.



Some choice quotes:

"This fight is not just about illegal immigration," said state Rep.
Thad Viers, R-Myrtle Beach, who helped organize the group. "The fight
is about preserving American culture and preserving our way of life."

In other words, it is NOT about law and order. It's about too many Hispanics.

"We want to make it very clear that we're not racists," said Patricia Matthews, the Minuteman chapter director.



"We just want our country back."



Most comments focused on Hispanics.



Audience
members and speakers alike appeared especially irritated by the growing
presence of the Spanish language, on telephone prompts and in
public-school classes.



"You ride by a work site and you don't see
black people there, and you don't see white people there," said
Margaret Thompson, a Clemson city councilwoman who has crusaded against
illegal immigration. "If it appears they are all Hispanic-speaking,
does not a red flag go up?"



***



Roan Garcia-Quintana, a Cuban immigrant and director of the
Mauldin-based group Americans Have Had Enough, said many illegal
immigrants are involved in other crimes and the government ignores it.



"I
do love the South, and by the grace of God I am Southern,"
Garcia-Quintana said. "If the rest of the U.S. doesn't want to do
anything, the Confederate States of America will rise again and we will
do it."



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  1. Matt's Avatar
    Testimony today...unfortunately, delays to continue until 2010:

    http://www.uscis.gov/files/testimony/testimony_ETG_17jan08.pdf
  2. hmm's Avatar
    Perhaps, these people are indeed racists but the article seems so biased that it is hard to know for sure what was actually happening.

    Also in my view there is a huge distance between disliking people of some race and not wanting to live among them. For example, imagine that a neighborhood where you grew up and continue living becomes an unassimilated Korean neighborhood, where most children on the streets speak Korean to each other, and most businesses are Korean. If you are not Korean, would not you be upset? You way of life is being destroyed here. Would not you want to move to where e.g. your kids can speak English on the streets? And now imagine that many of those Korean are in the country illegally (no offense meant to Korea or any other country here). Would not you feel betrayed by your Government? So I think one should not paint this in black and white: things are more complex here, and some of these people may have a valid point. Just like people who illeglly cross the border in hopes for a better life have one.
  3. Another voice's Avatar
    Article exemplifies what we knew all along nothing has changed in the south. This is not about the Law or Immigration is just plain racism. That is why no matter how much you counter the antis arguments with factual evidence they are just not having it because is about something else, I do not think is about assimilation either through out the Immigration history of the US the 1st and 2nd generations are fully assimilated and as American as they can be.
  4. Another voice's Avatar
    From CNN.com

    Sending all illegal aliens home?

    Posted: 02:16 PM ET

    Republican presidential hopeful, former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee, signs a no amnesty pledge at a campaign event at North Greenville University in Tigerville, S.C., Wednesday, Jan. 16, 2008
    Republican presidential hopeful, former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee, signs a no amnesty pledge at a campaign event at North Greenville University in Tigerville, S.C., Wednesday, Jan. 16, 2008

    FROM CNN's Jack Cafferty:

    Mike Huckabee is vowing to enforce this nation's immigration laws and to send all illegal aliens home.

    The Republican presidential candidate was the first one to sign the pledge of an "immigration-reduction" group called "NumbersUSA." The so-called "No Amnesty" pledge means Huckabee is committed to opposing any "special path to citizenship" for the estimated 12 million illegal aliens in this country. He's also vowing to cut the number of illegal aliens already here by means of law enforcement.

    Huckabee signed the pledge in South Carolina, site of Saturday's Republican primary, where it's looking like a tight race.

    Throughout the campaign, Huckabee's opponents have called him weak on immigration... pointing to things like his support, as governor of Arkansas, for college scholarships for children of illegal aliens.

    However, Huckabee's talk on immigration got tougher last month, when he came out with his nine-point immigration plan. Among other things, it calls for sealing the U.S.-Mexican border, hiring more border patrol agents, enforcing the law on employers who hire illegals and making illegal aliens go home before they can apply to return to the U.S
  5. Legal and no longer waiting's Avatar
    "If you are not Korean, would not you be upset? You way of life is being destroyed here. Would not you want to move to where e.g. your kids can speak English on the streets? And now imagine that many of those Korean are in the country illegally (no offense meant to Korea or any other country here). Would not you feel betrayed by your Government? "

    If they are decent hard working people, I would definitely not be upset.

    I would be very-very upset if people beside tuned into crazy rasists, no matter how much they look or speak like me.
  6. Greg Siskind's Avatar
    >>Also in my view there is a huge distance between disliking people of some race and not wanting to live among them. For example, imagine that a neighborhood where you grew up and continue living becomes an unassimilated Korean neighborhood, where most children on the streets speak Korean to each other, and most businesses are Korean. If you are not Korean, would not you be upset?
  7. hmm's Avatar
    "If they are decent hard working people, I would definitely not be upset."

    Sorry, I very much doubt you would choose to live in ethnic neighborhood of different ethnicity, but even if this is true, you are an immigrant and accustommed to immigrants. Also maybe you have no children? When you send them to school where most students speak Spanish to each other during lunch and recess, things will start seem a bit different.

    "I would be very-very upset if people beside tuned into crazy rasists, no matter how much they look or speak like me."

    Nobody likes crazy people whatever the reason for their craziness. And some of those Minuteman are indeed crazy-crazy racists. And then there are others who just have a different vision of where this country should be going. No need to call them racists, I think.
  8. hmm's Avatar
    "Yes, this is pretty much textbook racism and the fear of neighborhoods "tipping" has justified segregation in this country for generations. Revealing."

    If you really send your kids to an ethnic school, then I shall believe you mean what you say.

    As for me, I prefer diverse student body for my kids. Even if the school is excellent academically, I would be wary of a school that is say 90% white/or black/or asian/or hispanic/or whatever. And I do prefer that an absolute majority of them speak English.

  9. Greg Siskind's Avatar
    >>Sorry, I very much doubt you would choose to live in ethnic neighborhood of different ethnicity, but even if this is true, you are an immigrant and accustommed to immigrants. Also maybe you have no children? When you send them to school where most students speak Spanish to each other during lunch and recess, things will start seem a bit different.
  10. hmm's Avatar
    Oh, then you probably speak fluent Spanish, and I see why you have no problem within Spanish speaking community. But please understand that not all people have a benefit of growing up in bilingual enviroment. I bet those Minutemen's Spanish is close to none; people who speak several languages tend to be more tolerant. A wonderful thing about this country is that it is big and diverse, and there is a place for everybody, and in particular, if some people want to live like they did 100 years ago: all white, all straight, I say there must be a place for them too, and there is no need to call them racists. The may not be all bad, but since they were not raised in diversity and tolerance, it is too late now.. I say just leave them alone.

    I think it is not too hard to imagine yourself in their place. Just replace Spanish with some language you do not know, like Korean, or Russian, or Chinese, and imagine several million people of that nationality settling in your state.. replacing English/Jewish/Spanish culture in your neighborhood with their own. Well, maybe you'll like this, but I think it is not hard to imagine good people (not racists) who would be uncomfortable that their childhood world is disappearing...
  11. hmm's Avatar
    I think Europe is a good example of what I am trying to say. It is great to grow up as a Swiss speaking several languages and being in the heart of the old world but each nation there, no matter how small, holds their own, and there is a good reason for that. People of different nationalities are different, and the borders are there for a reason. Not all people like to mix.
  12. Legal and no longer waiting's Avatar
    "Sorry, I very much doubt you would choose to live in ethnic neighborhood of different ethnicity, but even if this is true, you are an immigrant and accustommed to immigrants. Also maybe you have no children? When you send them to school where most students speak Spanish to each other during lunch and recess, things will start seem a bit different. "

    Quite honestly, I'd be delighted to. Spanish is #1 native language on this planet, so I would VERY MUCH want my kids to learn Spanish, and what is a better way to learn than from native speakers? In fact, I would even consider moving into a Spanish part of town if I lived in the Southwest (not many Hispanics where I live) so that my kids have to learn the language. And no, I don't speak Spanish. I sure want to. I try to pick it up word by word whenever I am exposed to it.

    "People of different nationalities are different, and the borders are there for a reason. Not all people like to mix."

    And you would be one of them, I take it. So, why have you moved to a different country? Is it really only for the money? You do no consider this country a wonderful opportunity to make friends with people from all over the world?

    Maybe, just maybe, it is time to start judging people by their character, not by the language they speak at home. Maybe it is time to evolve.
  13. Greg Siskind's Avatar
    LNLW - I just came across this extremely cool, free web site for those wanting to learn a few different foreign languages - http://www.mangolanguages.com/ . My daughter and I were playing around with the French module yesterday and were pretty impressed.
  14. USC's Avatar
    "Also in my view there is a huge distance between disliking people of some race and not wanting to live among them."

    Isn't that what the thugs of apartheid South Africa used to say?

    "Sorry, but this is really just prejudiced thinking and you sound like you don't have a clue that this is not normal."

    Yes, you are right Greg.

    Hmm, I don't know if you realize it or not but your posts are racist, full of prejudice and bigotry. You should be ashamed of posting such garbage on this blog.
  15. Another voice's Avatar
    "Hmm" is so closed minded, he supposedly for diversity yet when diversity comes close to him he prefers english only. it makes you say hmmmmmm!!!!!!!
  16. Legal and no longer waiting's Avatar
    "I am not gay. Not that anything's wrong with it." (c) Jerry Seinfeld.
  17.     's Avatar
    >> I think Europe is a good example of what I am trying to say.

    Europe is not normal. Europe has a pretty sordid history in terms of race (Germans!) or language (French!) even if you look at just this century.
  18.      's Avatar
    If it's any comfort, Spanish and English are related derivative languages.

    http://www.bartleby.com/61/8.html
  19. hmm's Avatar
    To wrap up what I wanted to say:

    1) seems like your definition of a racist is way more inclusive than mine. And given the fact that a racist is a really dirty word in this country (almost like nazi or communist) people should take care when using it, I think. Else it would lose its meaning.

    2) like everything else diversity should be taken in moderation depending on person's preferences. Diversity is another overused word, and here by "taken" I do not mean taken by society as a whole. Who am I to decide for the society. Rather I am talking about myself and the things that makes me tick, that give me pleasure and happiness, and the things that I can bring to the society and the culture. While I admire people who have the stamina to constantly learn new things and languages, and expand their horizons, I am not like that. It took me a lot of time just to learn some English. I prefer to focus on what is important to me and not to get distracted by lots of new experiences. Maybe after I swallow and digest the culture of the English speaking world, I shall move to Spanish, but this will have to wait, I fear.
  20.             's Avatar
    >> seems like your definition of a racist is way more inclusive than mine

    Racism is frequently confused with ethnic or linguistic nationalism which is what is happening in this case. Racism as it is commonly understood (UN CERD definition) is essentially an European invention transplanted to other nations by European emigrants.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism#Ethnic_nationalism
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