During the Great Depression, Congress and President Hoover responded to strong public pressure and did the one thing the wisest economists warned against - they enacted massive new trade barriers to protect US companies from competition. Countries around the world did the same and the result was a decline in world trade that many believe made the Depression much worse. Today there are more global trade agreements in place that make this less likely, but we're hearing that many of the antis out there are smelling an opportunity to try and kill the valuable H-1B program (though that would be very hard given our treaty obligations).
The American Immigration Lawyers Association has just released a helpful essay explaining the importance of the program that is worth republishing in whole:
Maintaining America’s Global Competitiveness in a Time of World Economic Crisis
WASHINGTON, DC -- America’s economy is in a tailspin. As our nation struggles to reverse the downward spiral and get back on course, America’s H-1B program has come under fire. And when H-1B’s are discussed, emotions run high. Recent articles have targeted the program as ‘anti-American” and “unpatriotic,” but what exactly is America’s H-1B program designed to do? Let’s set the record straight!
The H-1B program is a long-standing part of our nation’s business immigration system. It was developed to give U.S. employers access to highly skilled, professional foreign talent (often students who have been educated here in U.S. universities) for up to six years and as a means for U.S. companies to stay ahead in their respective global markets. Data proves that H-1B petitions track the economy. When hiring is down, the number of H-1B petitions goes down. The program is self-adjusting. However, when the economy improves, there is no corresponding escalator. Thus, during the boom years, businesses were hamstrung by a quota that did not take into account the needs of the international marketplace. The program remained capped at 65,000 visas per year for bachelor’s degree positions, with another 20,000 for advanced degree holders who graduated from U.S. universities.
Now that the economy is not booming, judicious admission of international professionals is more important than ever. Where the program was used to fill in labor shortages that no longer exist, companies have stopped using H-1B workers in those occupations. But even companies that have been laying off workers need isolated, specific skills to better compete in the international marketplace and effect their own recovery. U.S. businesses MUST have access to specialty skills without having to locate operations outside the U.S. to obtain them. Otherwise, the entire nation’s economic recovery will be severely hobbled.
There remain vital areas that require that our system make adequate provision for future needs. Studies have shown that over the next ten years, the U.S. may need two million more K-12 teachers in this country. We will also need 250,000 new math and science teachers by the end of 2010. Further, nearly 80 million baby boomers are expected to leave the workforce sometime soon. In 2004, the U.S. produced 137,000 new engineers, compared to China’s 352,000. It is well-documented that America is well behind the curve in producing sufficient skilled professionals to make our country “tomorrow’s center” for innovation. Recent economic events have not changed these facts; they have made it all the more important that we deal with them.
The H-1B visa category is used by universities, school districts, hospitals, research organizations, and businesses competing in our global marketplace to fill needed specialty occupations. “Let’s say a school district in rural Iowa or in poor urban area of Chicago needs a math or science teacher to help students be prepared to compete and innovate in our global economy,” said Charles H. Kuck, President of the American Immigration Lawyers Association (AILA). “Does it really make sense for our children to go without, or should we encourage the entry of qualified educators from abroad? What about our research institutions developing new medical cures or our hospitals trying to care for an increasingly large aging population? We have to recognize that while not a panacea, the H-1B visas program, when used according to law, provides a critical resource to help drive our future economic success.”
Hiring the H-1B professional seems like a good solution so long as the reason for lack of interest by U.S. workers is not low pay and as long as protections are in place to ensure that qualified U.S. workers are not replaced by foreign labor. In fact, H-1B regulations require that workers on these visas are paid the HIGHER of the prevailing wage or the actual wages of comparable U.S. workers within the company. This wage protection insures that H-1B professionals are not used as “cheap labor. In addition, H-1B regulations do not allow a company to use the H-1B category to break a strike or lockout - or to replace U.S. workers laid off the same job,” Kuck stated. “In other words,” Kuck noted, “protections against those abuses already are in the law.”
In addition to the wage protections in the law, the fact is that H-1Bs cannot be “cheap labor.” H-1Bs are hired at a high transaction cost. The government charges most employers $2,320 per application, on top of the additional legal and human resource expenses that come with an H-1B hire. Also, if the H-1B worker is fired, the employer must buy his plane ticket home—an often expensive proposition.
To put the impact of H-1B professionals in perspective, with a U.S. workforce of about 145 million, H-1B employees account for less than one-tenth of one percent of the U.S. workforce.
Enforcement of the H-1B protections and requirements is critical to create a level playing field for employers and employees alike, which is why part of the fees paid by H-1B sponsoring employers are used to fund the enforcement of the H-1B regulations, as well as training programs for U.S. workers. Penalties for failing to comply with the labor protections of the H-1B category as to wages, posting requirements, etc. include a provision that a company may be barred from serving as an H-1B petitioner in the future. The typical legally compliant company uses the H-1B category because it needs skilled professionals to enhance competitiveness. This need continues in specific specialty niches in our economy, even when economic times are tough.
What is the predictable result of a reduction or loss of the H-1B category? Companies will be forced to locate overseas, where a high skilled worker pool is available, or outsource needed labor. “We need an H-1B reality check,” said Kuck. “The simple solution is not cutting off an aid to our economic independence, but instead continuing to use legal immigration tools that help us improve our children’s and our country’s future.”
WASHINGTON, DC -- America’s economy is in a tailspin. As our nation struggles to reverse the downward spiral and get back on course, America’s H-1B program has come under fire. And when H-1B’s are discussed, emotions run high. Recent articles have targeted the program as ‘anti-American” and “unpatriotic,” but what exactly is America’s H-1B program designed to do? Let’s set the record straight!
The H-1B program is a long-standing part of our nation’s business immigration system. It was developed to give U.S. employers access to highly skilled, professional foreign talent (often students who have been educated here in U.S. universities) for up to six years and as a means for U.S. companies to stay ahead in their respective global markets. Data proves that H-1B petitions track the economy. When hiring is down, the number of H-1B petitions goes down. The program is self-adjusting. However, when the economy improves, there is no corresponding escalator. Thus, during the boom years, businesses were hamstrung by a quota that did not take into account the needs of the international marketplace. The program remained capped at 65,000 visas per year for bachelor’s degree positions, with another 20,000 for advanced degree holders who graduated from U.S. universities.
Now that the economy is not booming, judicious admission of international professionals is more important than ever. Where the program was used to fill in labor shortages that no longer exist, companies have stopped using H-1B workers in those occupations. But even companies that have been laying off workers need isolated, specific skills to better compete in the international marketplace and effect their own recovery. U.S. businesses MUST have access to specialty skills without having to locate operations outside the U.S. to obtain them. Otherwise, the entire nation’s economic recovery will be severely hobbled.
There remain vital areas that require that our system make adequate provision for future needs. Studies have shown that over the next ten years, the U.S. may need two million more K-12 teachers in this country. We will also need 250,000 new math and science teachers by the end of 2010. Further, nearly 80 million baby boomers are expected to leave the workforce sometime soon. In 2004, the U.S. produced 137,000 new engineers, compared to China’s 352,000. It is well-documented that America is well behind the curve in producing sufficient skilled professionals to make our country “tomorrow’s center” for innovation. Recent economic events have not changed these facts; they have made it all the more important that we deal with them.
The H-1B visa category is used by universities, school districts, hospitals, research organizations, and businesses competing in our global marketplace to fill needed specialty occupations. “Let’s say a school district in rural Iowa or in poor urban area of Chicago needs a math or science teacher to help students be prepared to compete and innovate in our global economy,” said Charles H. Kuck, President of the American Immigration Lawyers Association (AILA). “Does it really make sense for our children to go without, or should we encourage the entry of qualified educators from abroad? What about our research institutions developing new medical cures or our hospitals trying to care for an increasingly large aging population? We have to recognize that while not a panacea, the H-1B visas program, when used according to law, provides a critical resource to help drive our future economic success.”
Hiring the H-1B professional seems like a good solution so long as the reason for lack of interest by U.S. workers is not low pay and as long as protections are in place to ensure that qualified U.S. workers are not replaced by foreign labor. In fact, H-1B regulations require that workers on these visas are paid the HIGHER of the prevailing wage or the actual wages of comparable U.S. workers within the company. This wage protection insures that H-1B professionals are not used as “cheap labor. In addition, H-1B regulations do not allow a company to use the H-1B category to break a strike or lockout - or to replace U.S. workers laid off the same job,” Kuck stated. “In other words,” Kuck noted, “protections against those abuses already are in the law.”
In addition to the wage protections in the law, the fact is that H-1Bs cannot be “cheap labor.” H-1Bs are hired at a high transaction cost. The government charges most employers $2,320 per application, on top of the additional legal and human resource expenses that come with an H-1B hire. Also, if the H-1B worker is fired, the employer must buy his plane ticket home—an often expensive proposition.
To put the impact of H-1B professionals in perspective, with a U.S. workforce of about 145 million, H-1B employees account for less than one-tenth of one percent of the U.S. workforce.
Enforcement of the H-1B protections and requirements is critical to create a level playing field for employers and employees alike, which is why part of the fees paid by H-1B sponsoring employers are used to fund the enforcement of the H-1B regulations, as well as training programs for U.S. workers. Penalties for failing to comply with the labor protections of the H-1B category as to wages, posting requirements, etc. include a provision that a company may be barred from serving as an H-1B petitioner in the future. The typical legally compliant company uses the H-1B category because it needs skilled professionals to enhance competitiveness. This need continues in specific specialty niches in our economy, even when economic times are tough.
What is the predictable result of a reduction or loss of the H-1B category? Companies will be forced to locate overseas, where a high skilled worker pool is available, or outsource needed labor. “We need an H-1B reality check,” said Kuck. “The simple solution is not cutting off an aid to our economic independence, but instead continuing to use legal immigration tools that help us improve our children’s and our country’s future.”
legal immigrant: I think invasion of privacy is a bigger violation of the law than some nebulous "defamation." Considering the numurous cases of cybercrime tied to H-1Bs, that might be some bad publicity.
Posted by: another legal immigrant | February 12, 2009 at 03:23 AM
ha ha tunnel rat is also started advertising his blog about greg siskind on dice.com a famous recruiting site
see this link on dice
http://seeker.dice.com/olc/thread.jspa?threadID=12623&tstart=0
Posted by: Dice User | February 11, 2009 at 06:38 PM
A Legal Immigrant - I doubt very much anything I had to say to this gentleman would have an impact and I would suggest you ignore him. I suspect attention is what he most craves.
Posted by: Greg Siskind | February 11, 2009 at 06:34 PM
Dear Mr.Siskind,
The tunnel rat guy has hurt the feelings of so many legally working Indians who are in america paying their taxes, following rules and leading their life.
he is a psycho and a lunatic and am sure is a danger to a immigrant.
You are an attorney he has put your photo on his blog and called you bad names, why cannot you issue a subpena or whatever and try to find out who this guy is, he has hidden his domain, only a attorney can request godaddy.com to reveal his identity.
once you get his identity why dont you sue him for deformity of your profile. a google search of greg siskind puts any one on his blog where he has used abused your name and put sexual content references to your name.
If a educated famous attorney like you is silent what can a common person do.
Please take measures urgently and quickly to put a fullstop to his idiotic rants.
Posted by: A Legal Immigrant | February 11, 2009 at 06:25 PM
This guy is absolutely right and his thinking is so logical that is beyond one's imagination. i would like to appreciate this guy in general and on behalf of all americans to post this thread. i hope president read this thread and take some quick and fast action before the time runs out. this year a lot of skilled students taking american degree are moving out of america so it would be in the benefit of nation if these students are somehow allowed stay in USA. Some actions are really needed to be taken
Posted by: Nick | February 09, 2009 at 03:32 PM
"This guy is so foul and so full of hate. I am really worried about the people that work with him. I hope he is not in California."
He may be representing FAIR or CIS..hate groups that is what they do..hate!
Posted by: George Chell | February 06, 2009 at 04:50 PM
And one more thing .. He put your picture on his Blog too..
Posted by: d | February 06, 2009 at 02:51 PM
Greg,
This guy is so foul and so full of hate. I am really worried about the people that work with him. I hope he is not in California .
Posted by: d | February 06, 2009 at 02:50 PM
FYI - Mr. TunnelRat has been banned for the use of foul language which I've warned readers is one of the reasons you will be ejected from the discussion.
He can rant on using such language on his own blog.
Your blogger.
Posted by: Greg Siskind | February 06, 2009 at 02:22 PM
I see Lou Dobbs and others love to complain about foreigners working in the US, while they have no complaints about Americans working abroad even top positions...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/4539418/Chip-Goodyear-the-first-foreigner-to-run-Temasek.html
"Mr Goodyear, who will be the first foreigner to run Temasek, was born in Connecticut but raised in Texas, where his father worked in the oil industry."
In fact Dobbs even mentioned it in his show but did not say that Goodyear should return to the US while he was ranting about sending foreigners working in the US, including Singaporeans, back home! This is what I call Americans demanding privilege, while not willing to extend that privilege to others. Then again, if you talk to Singaporeans on the street they all want to work abroad but dont like foreigners working in Singapore. But, the Brits are the number one culprits regarding this attitude. Selfishness, I suppose!
However, the number one beneficiary is the Republic of Singapore!
Posted by: George Chell | February 06, 2009 at 12:50 PM
"Ron Paul is most extreme when it comes to immigration. He wanted to limit the birth right citizenship."
Precisely! He is not libertarian..he is a fraud bordering on racism!
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 09:05 PM
"because I donated money to Ron Paul once"
Ron Paul is most extreme when it comes to immigration. He wanted to limit the birth right citizenship.
Posted by: d | February 05, 2009 at 06:59 PM
"because I donated money to Ron Paul once"
The man is no libertarian. In some respects he sounds more like a Marxist!
"I also love that birth certificate rumor - people who spread it mostly are not aware that it was McCain who was not born in the US!"
There are folks who are using the argument that Hawaii should never have become a state of the US in order to question Obama's credentials as a US citizen!
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 06:45 PM
"In your alternate universe maybe.
In this world, the real world, that is not true. We have shortages in lots of areas, except probably the mortgage industry.
Oh, and it seems we have shortages in the dictionary industry as well, since you apparently can't afford one. It is "discipline"..."
Are all the Americans graduating either A or B students. I doubt it! Are they all graduating from top notch programs like Princeton, Stanford, MIT or Purdue? I doubt it. Will Americans have this opportunity without foreign corporations such as BMW funding the entire Mechanical Engineering Department at Clemson while South Carolina abdicates its responsibility to the state school, or without Mitsubishi funding the University of California at Santa Barbara? I doubt it. The best performers should be given the job without consideration to citizenship. The government role should be restricted to improving the quality of American students to compete in the global program, not give an assurance of a job. You are not owned one. As I have said it is very interesting that folks who oppose Affirmative Action are the same who oppose competition from Asian Americans and foreigners in fields such as computer science and engineering. They want quotas or set asides whether they are the best or not.
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 06:42 PM
"because I donated money to Ron Paul once"
That cracked me up!!! I also love that birth certificate rumor - people who spread it mostly are not aware that it was MsCain who was not born in the US!
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 05, 2009 at 05:46 PM
"Right now we are graduating more people in every decipline than the workforce can absorb."
In your alternate universe maybe.
In this world, the real world, that is not true. We have shortages in lots of areas, except probably the mortgage industry.
Oh, and it seems we have shortages in the dictionary industry as well, since you apparently can't afford one. It is "discipline"...
Posted by: JoeF | February 05, 2009 at 05:41 PM
"LOL! Hawaii already produced their #1 horror - a really smart biracial "mutt" with a funny name, who went to become President!"
Right up to the inauguration, I got spam mail from some "conservative" group (no idea where they got my email address from, probably because I donated money to Ron Paul once) that perpetuated the false reports of Obama's birth certificate missing. These guys really got on my nerves. Nowadays, they sprout similar BS, claiming that bailout money would go to illegals.
Posted by: JoeF | February 05, 2009 at 05:37 PM
Another reason why IBM creates more jobs India? That is where it does a large proportion of its business..in other words, that is where the market is...not in the US.
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 02:48 PM
"A spokesman for Alliance@IBM, a workers' group that is affiliated with the Communications Workers of America but does not have official union status at IBM, slammed the initiative.
"IBM not only is offshoring its work to low-cost countries, now IBM wants employees to offshore themselves," spokesman Lee Conrad told CNN. "At a time of rising unemployment IBM should be looking to keep both the work and the workers in the United States.""
These guys are either not very bright or extremely arrogant who think that only the US can provide high paying jobs. Actually expats in these countries (particularly Nigeria and India) get hardship and housing allowance as well as AC generators. They will not be working for local salaries. They will not be paying either social security or US taxes (unless they make more than $84,000 per annum). However, we need to write to our congressmen to expand the H1-B visas so that these jobs can be kept at home, tax revenues enhanced and budget deficits and debt reduced. This is not new. I have seen entire operations from Proctor and Gamble and Schering Plough moved to Singapore (including US personnel) because they could not get visas for some H1-B applicants...happened after the last recession.
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 02:47 PM
See the signs :::
http://money.cnn.com/2009/02/05/news/companies/ibm_jobs/index.htm
Employees who would otherwise face layoffs from their North American jobs at IBM are being given the chance to work abroad through 'Project Match.'
Posted by: James | February 05, 2009 at 02:18 PM
"LOL! Hawaii already produced their #1 horror - a really smart biracial "mutt" with a funny name, who went to become President!"
I am very sure that many antis dont like that..He is still a DAR from mother's side using the technical definition but DAR will probably not consider him one for obvious reasons! Talking about really smart biracial "mutt" with funny names, plenty of them in Hawaii. Ran into a woman who looked white, but her last name was Japanese..then I find out her old man is a fourth generation Japanese and her mother is a white Aussie immigrant...super smart kid, aged 16 already sophomore at the University.
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 01:42 PM
"and hope that it does not in anyway (horrors!!) look like Hawaii!"
LOL! Hawaii already produced their #1 horror - a really smart biracial "mutt" with a funny name, who went to become President!
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 05, 2009 at 01:13 PM
"The real truth is that they just don't like people who are not like them, and they will hold on to any fake argument to mask their bigotry."
Absolutely right. Actually close to 6,000 H1-Bs go to actors from Europe and Australia..almost all of them white! And that is 6,000 out of 60,000 jobs when there are many aspiring unemployed actors, both white, but quite a few minorities. There are attractive Asian Americans here in Hawaii who have lived here for generations and they could not get into a series set in Hawaii while they brought in an Aussie actor..remember Baywatch Hawaii? No complaints from FAIR or CIS there. However, there are 180,000 H1-B programmers in this country out of a total of 4,000,000..4.5%..less than half the proportion...and oh yes, these racist groups would raise a hue and cry! It all comes down to bigotry at FAIR and CIS. These guys are upset that I call them bigots..I told them I will work with them if they can show me that a A grade American was not hired over a C grade foreigner. This was two years ago! I have yet to hear back from them! They know jobs will move abroad but they dont care for the American worker. Their goal is to keep America majority white and hope that it does not in anyway (horrors!!) look like Hawaii!
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 11:15 AM
"Mr. Suskind and the whole H-1B industry are modern day slave merchants, using political bribes and loopholes in our system to make tons of money off of the backs of exploited foreign programmers and displaced American developers."
Do you think those jobs will go to Americans if foreigners are stopped from coming or do you think those jobs will migrate to find another home somewhere in the Asia-Pacific region? The number of computer programmer positions have fallen even after restricting H1-B to 65,000 in 2003 and even Norman Matloff would argue that the wages have remained stagnant or continued to fall even more sharply after 2003! Why do you think that is? It is called the global economy. A foreigner restricted from coming does not necessarily mean a job for an American..I hope the Looser's Guild get it through their thick skulls!
Posted by: George Chell | February 05, 2009 at 11:05 AM
@tunnelrat:
There are ways to file a complaint with the DoL if the employer fails to follow the US laws.
I always encourage people to do that if they are abused. THAT's the way to deal with these things, not by abolishing the H1.
And it works. These shady employers know very well that they are abusing the law. They just count on the employees not knowing. I try to help the people understand that they have rights here.
Posted by: JoeF | February 05, 2009 at 10:08 AM
d absolutely correct, We tend to forget the human aspect of it. These young guys come to a completely new environment, a foreign country, leaving their usual support structure behind. They should be applauded for the courage it takes. The roommates provide that support structure or some semblance of it, some company, some education on the tricks of the new land they are in.
Posted by: James | February 05, 2009 at 09:25 AM
James, I agree, the events of the story may not be fake, but his interpretation most certainly is. Read this "Digging deeper I discovered an ugliness where multiple Indian people were living in squalor, in cramped small apartments unable to afford decent affordable housing." - this is a PATENT LIE! Of course, they are able to afford decent housing, and quite frankly, it is none of his business why they chose to live like that!
If anything, he should be praising them for saving their money and not squandering it on new cars every 2 years, 3,000 sq. ft. houses, flat panel TVs in every room - you know the things that got many Americans up to their eye in debt and led to current unreveling of the economy. But of course, for this allegedly moderate-conservative country, these conservative values of hard work and pinching pennies are something of an alien nature, and people who exercise them should be called upon.
Now, let's think about what would have heppened if the H1s were never underpaid. What do you think these people would have been saying? How about - why do American companies are hiring all those foreigners at those unrealistically high salaries, which they should be paying to American citizens, because Americans deserve them by default. I know because that what the anti-immigration people in my country are saying. The real truth is that they just don't like people who are not like them, and they will hold on to any fake argument to mask their bigotry. There is really no winning this battle - if you are paid too low, then you should be sent back for your own good; if you are paid too high, then it is travesty agains the American workforce. The argument itself is not something that we should be fighting about because it is just a cover-up. We should just poke them with counters until they admit that they just don't like immigrants.
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 05, 2009 at 09:23 AM
Guys go and read Upton Sinclairs book The Jungle , All third and fourth generation descendants of immigrants know how their grand parents have lived in this country.
And one more thing living with in the means is a virtue, it is not a thing to be ashamed of . Hope this downturn will cut the insane consumption and save some resources on the planet for next generations. Hope this downturn will reduce the excesses of people.
People who blame H1bs, try to live with in your means , thats the solution for most of your problems not deporting legal immigrants.
Even if you are to deport most of the H1bs , they will be happier than you are because most of the h1bs have stronger families for support.
Posted by: d | February 05, 2009 at 09:17 AM
Hold off Legal ... I was just attesting to the fact that the "story" is not fake ... TunnelRat is just looking at one part of it with a jaundiced eye against H1B. Those guys WANT to live like that .... it is by choice and not by need and certainly not because they get paid too little.
Posted by: James | February 05, 2009 at 09:02 AM
So, James, did you have to live with 5 other people in a cramped apartment? That's exactly what I was arguing - even if it is true that the H1 holders were underpaid, they were not underpaid as much as to not to be able to afford good housing, unless it was their own choice to live with roommates. I also want to add to this story that the number of 20-something recent college grad Americans who are paid comparable (if not less) money than these Indian guys and have to live with roommates is quite high, too. Without condoning the behavior of the employer, I should note that stories like that (my grandpa came to this country in his 20s with broken English and $5 to his name - and had to work hard and live with 5 other guys in the same apartment for several years to establish himself in the new country) is the stuff immigration legacy/legends. So, again, what is all the fuss about?
By the way, I was on H1B, too, and my story (or as you like to call it - fact) is completely different. So, for every fact, there is another fact to tramp it.
Now, if you want to know what I would suggest to make it harder to abuse H1 visas, it is in my very first response to this article - make H1 like EAD, fully transferable and extendable by the holder himself, much like a work permit in more immigrationally developed countries. Let the market take care of the salary issue. If you, however, want to second TunnelRat's opinion, he will suggest that the already measely 65K H1 quota should be lowered and more stupid regulation introduced. As a result, ever fewer employers will be willing to sponsor an H1 visa, thus restricting the market forces and ensuring that the H1 person will have to stick to their employer no matter what - thus, leading to more abuse. Is not it ironic that everything the "anti-abuse" people propose will lead to more abuse? Maybe, it is just because there is not enough abuse to go around and they need more?
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 05, 2009 at 08:54 AM
Unfortunately Legal and no longer waiting, the "story" is not a story, it is a fact. I have seen it (not lived it) myself. I am on H1B. The culprits may of may not be the consulting companies that pay too less, it is the person. These guys come here on a short term project, their mentality is to stinge on everything and save as much money as possible till the very last day of their stay. Meanwhile, they keep searching for a permanent job, once they have some sort of "finality", they either move out into a "nicer" place or spend a ton on gifts to take back home.
Posted by: James | February 05, 2009 at 08:31 AM
Oh, another one of those fake H1 stories. The problem with your story is that even it were true, it just does not check out withing itself. Bloomington, Illinois has a average per capita income of $24,751 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloomington,_Illinois), and your fake poor people who were "cramped small apartments unable to afford decent affordable housing" were actually making $36,000 a year, or almost 50% more than per capita income. So, please, next time do not underestimate the intelligence of the people around you - at least come up with a plausible lie.
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 05, 2009 at 08:03 AM
TunnelRat - I actually am a little more sympathetic with your example than you might think. My basic belief is that there should not be an H-1B cap at all and that the market should determine the number. I've never been thrilled with how some of the large overseas-based IT contractors operate, though I think that the portability option for H-1B workers takes some of the power to exploit away. But I also think that if we're stuck with a cap, we ought to have a more fair way to distribute. A huge percentage of the H-1Bs go to a handful of these contractor firms. Perhaps we should either set limits on the number that any company can use or impose higher fees as companies go over a certain threshold number of H-1B workers. A whole lot of employers just need a key person or two and are shut out of the H-1B process because all the numbers get used up so quickly. Maybe we could also look at removing the caps all together for the companies that only hire 1 to 3 H-1Bs over the course of a year.
Posted by: Greg Siskind | February 05, 2009 at 07:35 AM
Here's they type of conditions Mr. Suskind perpetuates:
"In Bloomington at an apartment I was renting was a group of Indians living next door. I spoke with one of the occupants seen on occasion at State Farm, an IT Analyst. As he spoke in broken English he explained there are four of them living in a one bedroom apartment all working for the same Indian outsourcing firm Satyam. It was out of necessity for them to pool their money in order to afford housing. The prevailing wages for a typical IT Analyst in Bloomington, Illinois (2002-2004) averaged in the $40-50 per hour range and he stated he was making $18 per hour less than half of what the going rate was for an American worker (4). Digging deeper I discovered an ugliness where multiple Indian people were living in squalor, in cramped small apartments unable to afford decent affordable housing. It was kept quiet among the H-1Bs one saying the living conditions were far better with four living in a small apartment than they were back home in India."
Mr. Suskind and the whole H-1B industry are modern day slave merchants, using political bribes and loopholes in our system to make tons of money off of the backs of exploited foreign programmers and displaced American developers.
Posted by: TunnelRat | February 05, 2009 at 07:20 AM
"Right now we are graduating more people in every decipline than the workforce can absorb. "
And anybody can have an "opinion", even if they pull it out of their behind with no referece to reality.
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 05, 2009 at 06:41 AM
Can someone explain, please , why are people arguing over H1 visas , and not for the green card lottery?
Why is it OK to give the privilege of permanent residency to people who didn't do anything for it? Was it ever considered to scrap the green card lottery and give those numbers of visas to specialists?
Posted by: c_Nova | February 05, 2009 at 03:16 AM
Anybody can do a "study".
Right now we are graduating more people in every decipline than the workforce can absorb. There is no need for the H-1B program. It should be scrapped.
Posted by: StudyShmudy | February 05, 2009 at 02:09 AM
Problem is not Americans wanting to go to MBA or Sciences or even landscaping. My concern is that the Americans who complain about Affirmative Action asking the minoriites to compete are more likely the same Americans who are whining about better qualified and better quality foreigners! In other words, it is all about maintaining the privilege, be it Looser Dobbs or the Looser Guild!
Posted by: George Chell | February 04, 2009 at 03:38 PM
"As someone who trained my H1-B replacements on two jobs before being let go,"
Maybe you are better at training than doing the job.
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 04, 2009 at 02:00 PM
Well, obviously, most Americans would rather choose to pursue an MBA and a career with little hard science and much art (sales, marketing, accounting, finance, HR etc.), that pays well and often list "social/golf skills" as a preference. But the truth is that you can't build a contemporary economy on "soft skills", because it would implode just like the overblown financial and auto industries have done recently. Immigrants offer complimentary set of skills to the bell curve of American skill-set, on both low-skill blue collar end, and high skill hard science end. However, there will be some Americans from the middle of the bell curve who honestly believe that it is possible for the whole country to work in finance/marketing/HR.
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 04, 2009 at 01:59 PM
"And yes, I know this first-hand. I have worked as a TA in a good computer science curriculum at a good university."
Of the ten or so universities I have been associate with, only here at the University of Hawaii have I seen not use calcualtors for simple arithmetic..May be because they happen to be either immigrants or first generation?
Posted by: George Chell | February 04, 2009 at 01:52 PM
"Essays about skilled labor 'shortages' are unconvincing because it's not like America is lacking the knowledge and technology to educate/train any type of worker there is."
The issue is that you can't train people who don't want to be trained.
We don't have enough engineers, and Americans don't want to do the hard stuff and actually learn about engineering. Tell the kids that they need to do hard work to learn this, and they laugh at you.
And yes, I know this first-hand. I have worked as a TA in a good computer science curriculum at a good university.
Posted by: JoeF | February 04, 2009 at 12:51 PM
"As far as nurses I have a solution. Double the wages of nurses, let the health care cost increase, let the insurance refuse to pay and put our seniors on the street or force them to go to Thailand for medical care and presto to modify a Keynesian addage, in the short run we all will be dead!"
This was meant to be sarcasm. Perhaps twenty years ago, that is what Richard Lamm meant that all seniors should roll over and die. Putting his immigration views together with his views on seniors it does add up!
The only way for Americans to compete in the global economy other than skilled immigration is to train American workers. And when I look at the education budget cuts, I dont see that happening. Four years from now we will be facing even more severe shortage during the next potential economic boom and you will here all the antis shouting that we need to train more American workers..strange I dont see them demonstrating in front of the California State Capitol in Sacramento protesting education budget cuts. Dont see position papers from CIS or FAIR saying that budget cuts will lead to even more dependence on foreign workers or jobs moving abroad and I dont see people like Jack raising a hue and cry against it either. The folks who argue against foreign competition dont want any competition either from other Americans or from foreigners...and this includes FAIR and CIS.
Posted by: George Chell | February 04, 2009 at 12:14 PM
make perfect sense to me since all the smart Americans smart enough not to choose engineering.
Posted by: sw enginneer | February 04, 2009 at 11:57 AM
"As someone who trained my H1-B replacements on two jobs before being let go, I find the claims in this article laughable."
As someone who has seen loads of tax revenues being lost to other countries as a result of restrictions on skilled migration (jobs being transferred as well as Americans being transferred), I find your statement even more hilarious!
Posted by: George Chell | February 04, 2009 at 11:31 AM
"Are you implying that we can't reap the benefits of free trade except with imported labor via, e.g., H1? You can trade like crazy and simultaneously have restrictive immigration and non-immigrant work visas. It's the 'buy [i.e., goods, commodities, etc.] American' refrain which the economists are warning against when the Great Depression is brought up."
Incorrect argument in the global economy, where jobs move abroad faster than you can say outsourcing. And good luck trying to sell the surplus homes to Americans who cannot afford to buy them!
"Similarly, if a market wage is to be paid but the market is already distorted, as time goes on we can’t know what the market wage (minus imported labor) would be."
Market wage today is the global market wage. Try paying the American market wage and raising the prices. See who buys our products in other countries. So this argument is even more laughable.
"Maybe H1 isn’t as devastating to American workers as some claim, but maybe if there were no H1 (and immigrant labor in general), the domestic labor market, without imported labor, would fill the need much better than H1 proponents (those who get beyond ‘end of the world’ scare talk) claim. Maybe proponents don’t want America to ever find out in case they find things satisfactory without it. They are told that importing labor is an economic necessity. What if it proved not to be?"
May be try to spell quality of the workforce and ask yourselves the New Orleans levees and the Minneapolis Bridge..all built by Americans. May be we may not be able to export our products to other countries because it is no longer cheap due to higher wages.
"They’re a lot more populous, after all, and it’s more about quality than quantity."
Indded! That is why foreign students outperform American students in Engineering and there are plenty of Americans who cannot count 2+2 = 4 without a calculator!
"More is just more and 'sustainable growth' is an oxymoron. An example: California is facing a prolonged water crisis. Agriculture uses a ton of water. Non-agricultural business needs a ton of water. The population consumes a ton of water."
All because of ag subsidies to good old boys.
"The population consumes a ton of water. None, let alone all three, can grow forever due to the limiting factor of water supply. If the population keeps growing and consuming a greater share of the water, that puts a squeeze on economic activity which also needs water."
Foolish argument. Has not happened in densely populated Asia where the economy and population are growing faster than in the US.
"Prime farmland continues to be paved over to make room for more housing. The land owners get rich in the short term but how can this practice be good for the agriculture industry in the long term?"
These farms exist mostly due to Ag subsidies, not due to the efficiency of the farmers or the prime farmland.
"Greg, you have expressed concern over imported food. Can you see that population growth (which is primarily due to immigration) will lead to more food importation because the bigger California gets, the more mouths there will be to feed and the less farmland to grow the food and the less share of water to water the crops? Your side likes to talk about a portion of the fruit dying on the vine from lack of pickers. What about fruit dying on the vine due to the *entire* crop being abandoned from not enough water to go around?"
Perhaps we need to remove ag subsidies, put our inefficient farms out of business and import more food and need to hire more food inspectors at USDA.
"Greg, you seem to like economic and free market arguments so I’ll skip the ecological appeals such as ‘How can you justify adding population to this country when its ecological footprint is already in overshoot?’ Here’s a case for a more stable population in order to preserve a free market: the scarcer a resource becomes due to demand caused by increased population, the more various industries will have to fight against each other and with residential users. The government will become ever more intrusive and involved in allocating the resource rather than the more efficient market. The resource will not be put to the best economic use but rather to whoever has the most influential lobbyists, makes the highest campaign donations, etc. There is greater wiggle room for free economic activity the less we get to this point. If the situation becomes dire enough, resource rationing will result in constrained economic activity. Like a hidden tax, the price of the necessary resource might not be cost effective for a business to start or continue operation (if their industry is allowed enough of the resource at all by the government). Just the uncertainty of such a situation will deter investment and economic activity. In this way, overpopulation can ‘crowd out’ the economy. This is what California faces—today. Growers are getting cut off and California heading fast to 50 million exacerbates such problems. Maybe you don’t experience this as much in Memphis, but your home state of Florida faces similar land and resource issues caused by high population growth."
NONSENSE!! By your argument Singapore, Hong Kong and Taiwan will be the poorest in the world facing ecological disasters and Russia, Belarus and Ukraine would be the richest in the world with great environment and plenty of food production. In reality it is the other way around regarding economic growth. Singapore and others have been importing food for a long time and they are not economic disasters.
Your argument is no different from those who support Affirmative Action. The only difference is those folks ask to be given privilege for past discrimination, while you want privilege to protect yourselves against competition and better competition. Your economics is full of nonsense and should not fool anyone with a degree in economics. As far as nurses I have a solution. Double the wages of nurses, let the health care cost increase, let the insurance refuse to pay and put our seniors on the street or force them to go to Thailand for medical care and presto to modify a Keynesian addage, in the short run we all will be dead!
Posted by: George Chell | February 04, 2009 at 11:29 AM
As someone who trained my H1-B replacements on two jobs before being let go, I find the claims in this article laughable.
Posted by: Marvin | February 04, 2009 at 10:52 AM
Are you implying that we can't reap the benefits of free trade except with imported labor via, e.g., H1? You can trade like crazy and simultaneously have restrictive immigration and non-immigrant work visas. It's the 'buy [i.e., goods, commodities, etc.] American' refrain which the economists are warning against when the Great Depression is brought up.
Essays about skilled labor 'shortages' are unconvincing because it's not like America is lacking the knowledge and technology to educate/train any type of worker there is. It’s a very flexible, adaptive labor market (with or without H1). In other words, if a shortage were to arise, there's no impediment which would cause it to become permanent. As if it's somehow impossible for America to train, e.g., nurses. Absurd. How much the presence of H1 type visas distorts the incentives of the domestic labor market is an interesting question but hard to measure. Importing foreign labor into a field precludes the domestic labor market from adapting as it otherwise would—it’s no longer the same labor supply. A shortage is claimed but is the imported labor ameliorating shortage or just creating the appearance of one--a pseudo-shortage? How can you know when the imported labor is always present? If U.S. workers in a field think there will always be new non-immigrant labor presence in that field and thus go into that field in fewer numbers, is that really a shortage? Similarly, if a market wage is to be paid but the market is already distorted, as time goes on we can’t know what the market wage (minus imported labor) would be. Thus, is it fair and honest to claim that the ‘market’ wage is being paid if the new wage is really lower than what it would have been?
Maybe H1 isn’t as devastating to American workers as some claim, but maybe if there were no H1 (and immigrant labor in general), the domestic labor market, without imported labor, would fill the need much better than H1 proponents (those who get beyond ‘end of the world’ scare talk) claim. Maybe proponents don’t want America to ever find out in case they find things satisfactory without it. They are told that importing labor is an economic necessity. What if it proved not to be?
'Further, nearly 80 million baby boomers are expected to leave the workforce sometime soon.'
They aren't just expected to--they will, because even though they want to work longer than traditional retirement age (something these type of articles don't like to mention), nobody lives forever. But it’s not like they are leaving all at once. If you're really that concerned about this, guess what? America's population would keep growing right through this period even if there were zero net immigration. The Gen Y baby boomlet will continue to enter the workforce for years. It won't be the end of the world if (gasp) America doesn't have as many engineers (or anything) as China or India. They’re a lot more populous, after all, and it’s more about quality than quantity. Since when do you have to be huge to have an advanced economy? There's an implication that capitalism only works with an increasing labor supply/can't work with a flat or shrinking labor supply. Based on what economic theory?
Being a special interest, the AILA has a pecuniary interest in more immigration and non-immigrant visas so it's no surprise they peddle the same old cult of growth mantra--'more is better', 'bigger is better' with zero consideration of the negative aspects of growth or an acknowledgement that there are limits to growth. More is just more and 'sustainable growth' is an oxymoron. An example: California is facing a prolonged water crisis. Agriculture uses a ton of water. Non-agricultural business needs a ton of water. The population consumes a ton of water. None, let alone all three, can grow forever due to the limiting factor of water supply. If the population keeps growing and consuming a greater share of the water, that puts a squeeze on economic activity which also needs water. Prime farmland continues to be paved over to make room for more housing. The land owners get rich in the short term but how can this practice be good for the agriculture industry in the long term?
Greg, you have expressed concern over imported food. Can you see that population growth (which is primarily due to immigration) will lead to more food importation because the bigger California gets, the more mouths there will be to feed and the less farmland to grow the food and the less share of water to water the crops? Your side likes to talk about a portion of the fruit dying on the vine from lack of pickers. What about fruit dying on the vine due to the *entire* crop being abandoned from not enough water to go around?
Greg, you seem to like economic and free market arguments so I’ll skip the ecological appeals such as ‘How can you justify adding population to this country when its ecological footprint is already in overshoot?’ Here’s a case for a more stable population in order to preserve a free market: the scarcer a resource becomes due to demand caused by increased population, the more various industries will have to fight against each other and with residential users. The government will become ever more intrusive and involved in allocating the resource rather than the more efficient market. The resource will not be put to the best economic use but rather to whoever has the most influential lobbyists, makes the highest campaign donations, etc. There is greater wiggle room for free economic activity the less we get to this point. If the situation becomes dire enough, resource rationing will result in constrained economic activity. Like a hidden tax, the price of the necessary resource might not be cost effective for a business to start or continue operation (if their industry is allowed enough of the resource at all by the government). Just the uncertainty of such a situation will deter investment and economic activity. In this way, overpopulation can ‘crowd out’ the economy. This is what California faces—today. Growers are getting cut off and California heading fast to 50 million exacerbates such problems. Maybe you don’t experience this as much in Memphis, but your home state of Florida faces similar land and resource issues caused by high population growth.
Posted by: Jack | February 04, 2009 at 03:21 AM
Seems the anti-immigrants are getting a bit upset over the choice of Judd Gregg as Commerce Secretary, since he apparently is a supporter of the H1.
Posted by: JoeF | February 03, 2009 at 09:26 PM
The best thing they can do to take incentives out of abusing H1s is to make it easily portable, like EAD, and extendable by the holder. Would also help if one could file an EB visa based on employment history and not on future job. Just like it's done in countries with contemporary immigration systems.
Posted by: Legal and no longer waiting | February 03, 2009 at 02:18 PM
Why do we need a H1-B program more than ever? Because of this:
"Studies suggest that the United States could fall 16 million degree-holders short of its workforce needs by 2025."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/02/AR2009020202820.html
It is a tragedy that the antis, AP, Grassley and Durbin instead of addressing the education budget cuts are more interested in going after foreigners working in the US. Such an attitude will only lead to more jobs moving abroad in search of skills.
Posted by: George Chell | February 03, 2009 at 01:35 PM